Lyndal Sterenburg: The story of Es Una and changing women's lives

[01:25] Lyndal: Hi, Sonya. I'm really well, thank you.

[01:27] Sonya: Amazing. And thank you so much for joining us today. So why don't we kick things off? Tell us a little bit about who you are and why you're here today.

[01:38] Lyndal: Okay, so I turn 52 next week. Happy birthday for next week. Thank you very much. And I'm here today to talk about Es Una my business and to speak with you because I met you at Silver Sirens at the conference that was held recently in Sydney. And since then, I've been listening to your podcast and learning about menopause, the symptoms, what's happening, because personally, I'm yet to achieve it. I consider it a golden life.

[02:13] Sonya: I love that I haven't achieved that goal yet. It's such a great mindset and great attitude to have, I think.

[02:24] Lyndal: I think from my family. I mean, my mom had hysterectomy when I was a child. I think she was in her early 40s. So I don't have the lived experience of learning from my mother about that. But she had a strict man just sold it on, never spoke about it.

[02:41] Sonya: I did, yeah. And it would have been quite horrific for her as well. The symptoms that she because it's having surgically induced menopause, which is what a hysterectomy is, is the same as the medically induced medical pause that I had. And you get all of the symptoms all at once, and they are intensified. So I absolutely take my hat off to the ladies that went through this 40, 2040 years ago that did just soldier on. And there was no HRT or support at all, really, from their specialists and probably their families as well. So, yeah, I take my hats off to my hats. I have many hats. I take my hat off to them.

[03:29] Lyndal: That's right. We just knew she had an operation. Didn't even metaphors didn't even come into the discussion?

[03:34] Sonya: No, different times, unfortunately.

[03:39] Lyndal: Yeah. Talk about me a little bit. So, 52 next week, child of the 70s. Professionally, I've been working in marketing and consulting to professional services firms, so that's my history of being a consultant in the corporate world. And then in 2016, I had a little bit of an epiphany, I suppose, wanting to follow a passion. I do love my work with professional services firms, but we had an experience on the beach and I thought that's something I might like to investigate.

[04:19] Sonya: So tell us about that experience that you have because it sounds very mystical. I had an experience if you were in Ibiza and there was a hot man involved, this would be a whole different podcast.

[04:33] Lyndal: Absolutely. But no, it was on Phillip Island in Victoria, so we go there every Christmas, and I've got three kids and my middle daughter was twelve and she just wanted a new rashy. I've always been really SunSmart with my kids, they've always been slathered in in sunscreen and they always wore rashes. But when she hit twelve, she was growing into a young lady and she wanted a new rushy because hers was dangling down at her knees.

[05:04] Sonya: Now, I'm going to interrupt you just for 1 second and explain to my beautiful listeners that are not based in Australia that a rashie is a rash vest. In Australia, we like to shorten everything and put an IA on the end of it. So a rashi is a rash vest, which is an item of clothing that you would wear as sun protection. So it usually looks like a T shirt or a long sleeve shirt, something like that, just in case anyone's listening, going, A what?

[05:35] Lyndal: Yeah, and it's made out of bath fabric, so they were originally invented for body borders, because the body board, you'd get a rash on you. Yeah.

[05:47] Sonya: So they were originally oh, hence the name rushbest. Rushbest.

[05:52] Lyndal: There you are. Poke history.

[05:55] Sonya: Well, they say you should learn every day. I've learnt my thing today.

[05:59] Lyndal: Yeah, excellent. But that's what they're invented for. But obviously, being made from beta fabric, it's a really tight weave and so it's sun protective fabric as well. In Australia, we're all aware of melanoma, it's the most common cancer, affecting 20 to 39 year olds. It's amazingly prevalent. Somebody's diagnosed every 30 minutes with melanoma in Australia, so sun protection is a big deal.

[06:24] Sonya: It is.

[06:25] Lyndal: So anyway, in Australia, for those who don't live here, Rushies are pretty common, especially little kids. Especially little kids. And so at the time, this was, I think it was about 2016 anyway, she wanted a new rashy. We went all over Phillip Island to all the surf shops, all the swimwear shops, to try and find a rashy. She didn't want it to fit like a glove and often like a Rashid type fitting in.

[06:54] Sonya: Very body hunting, aren't they? Yes.

[06:56] Lyndal: And doesn't flatter every figure. And she was a bit self conscious, and she just wanted a Tshirt, and she was only able to find the men's size 18 to do the job. And that's pretty embarrassing for a young girl, having a twelve year old girl. Yeah, and she wasn't big. It's just that it was just her answer to have something loosefitting. That's what it was. And I just thought, there's got to be a better answer out there for young girls like her. And then we went back to the beach that afternoon, and I looked around me and I thought, most of the women on the beach are fully dressed. I just thought, this is actually not just her problem. And I didn't wear a rashi either. Like, I just wore a Tshirt or a cast hand or some sort of.

[07:44] Sonya: Beef dress that didn't win the sun protection.

[07:48] Lyndal: No, because cast hands, especially in sangs, it's not a very tight weave, and the sun just goes straight through and burns you, especially linen and things like that. People don't realize it's not actually offering much sun protection. But that sort of led me to research. And when I went home, I scoured the Internet trying to find a rashy solution that was flattering rather than figure hugging. And for women my age at the time and women my age now.

[08:18] Sonya: Often.

[08:19] Lyndal: We don't want something that fits like a sausage skin.

[08:22] Sonya: No.

[08:23] Lyndal: Managing our weight. And our body shape changes as we get older, and we want something to flatter, and I just couldn't find anything appropriate, so I thought, I'd invent my own well, that's up to you.

[08:39] Sonya: And I love that your brain and that's probably your marketing brain is kind of fired up by that experience of those two things, of realizing that you couldn't find anything and she couldn't find anything and then going back to the beach and then recognizing that actually there were a whole host of other women that were without asking them, but assuming they were all in the same situation and then taking that idea and running with it, I think that's amazing.

[09:09] Lyndal: Yeah. But I did have a problem with that idea because I've never done fashion design before.

[09:15] Sonya: Everything is figureoutable, and you obviously figured it out.

[09:18] Lyndal: Absolutely. Well, when I was in year ten and I did work experience in high school, I actually did it as a fashion designer. It was a passion back then, and then I just tucked it away and thought, I'll never earn money doing that. We often do that when we think of creative disease. And instead of following our passion, we actually put our sensible cap on and try and make a living. But I'm really lucky to be at a stage in my life where I can pursue a passion and try to make a living out of it.

[09:50] Sonya: It's amazing. So you went home, you did your research. What kind of were the next steps from there?

[09:58] Lyndal: Okay, so I did desk based research. And then I also did a survey myself of women aged, I think they were over 35 to 60. And I found in that survey, and it was a number of years ago that 70% wanted to set an example for their children by wearing rushes and some protective clothing, but only 10% did, largely because they had the problem that we had or we couldn't find something.

[10:26] Sonya: What a huge gap.

[10:28] Lyndal: Yeah. And 60% of these women I surveyed didn't want people to look at them in bathes. I didn't want to walk around on the beach. But when I walk around confidence, it's a huge issue. And then I found a British survey on body confidence and that I think it was through an anorexia foundation, but it's still regarding body confidence. 36% of women stopped doing exercise because they were embarrassed about how they looked.

[10:58] Sonya: While they were doing it, while they were exercising. Yep. Yeah, I've heard that step before being in the fitness industry, and it is just such a soul destroying fact for me that, you know, I mean, I absolutely can connect with the women that don't want to parade around on the beach in this swimsuit. But I've never transpired that into exercise for me, because that's not something that I've ever been concerned about. And then learning that I just found heartbreaking because exercise is so important and it's something that everybody should be doing and nobody should ever feel they can't do it out of fear of judgment or coming from that place of shame, I guess, as well. Is the driver behind those feelings, too.

[11:51] Lyndal: Yeah. And out of all the reading I did, it's self judgment that is the worst. And fashion is one of those remarkable things that can make you feel good. It might sound so you can go both ways.

[12:04] Sonya: It can go both ways. Both ways.

[12:08] Lyndal: But, you know, wearing a certain color can lift your spirits. Wearing certain styles or brands can lift your spirits. So I thought that if I can create a beachwear brand that helps more women to enjoy summer, that's a really good thing that I could do. So taking me years to sort of settle on my mission, which is for all women to enjoy summer, I love that.

[12:33] Sonya: Oh, my gosh, I love that so much. Yeah. And unfortunately, we still get so much marketing from the fitness industry as well as, you know, the beauty industry, as well as a problem here, too. And it's that you need a beachbody. Summer's coming. Get your beachbody. And it makes my blood boil, to be honest, because everybody has a body and it goes to a beach that is a beach body.

[13:05] Lyndal: But also it frustrates me. That the sort of movement to embrace how you look, which I do agree that it's all great if we think that we look good and we feel good about how we look, but there is a movement to say, oh, well, you have to wear revealing clothes or run around naked so you can show people that you embrace. My opinion is that, well, that's not right for me, and I'm sure that that's not right for many women. If I choose what I wear to COVID up something that I want to COVID up, then that's an acknowledgment. And if it doesn't stop me from doing anything, or if I can choose things to wear that sort of liberate me to do something, then that's terrific.

[13:49] Sonya: Yeah, I agree. So then tell us about that. So as soon as Esuna yes, asuna sorry.

[14:00] Lyndal: Esuna was named after my grandma Una.

[14:04] Sonya: Okay. Yeah.

[14:06] Lyndal: And I couldn't get youna.com au. I thought, I've got to find some sort of variation of her name for my business, and I wanted to call my business after her because two things, really. She used to apply her lipstick every day before she walked out the front door. And I remember as a little kid watching her apply it, and she blotted it with a tissue.

[14:36] Sonya: Sounds like it was almost like a little ritual for her.

[14:39] Lyndal: Yeah, it was a ritual, and it gave her a boost of confidence to take on the day, and it was just one of those things that she reappeared all the time, and I just thought, yeah, that's the little thing that she does to make her feel confident.

[14:50] Sonya: I love that.

[14:51] Lyndal: And so that I wanted that spirit in my brand of swimwear. And the other thing about my grandma that relates to my business is that she was a real early adopter. So any new food at the supermarket, she got it before anyone else got it. Any sort of medical treatment, she got it for anyone else did it. She was doing needling for arthritis well before it became fashionable or popular. This is years ago, before the two thousands. So she was just one of those women who said, oh, that's something new. I'll give it a try. And so I wanted that spirit to be part of the name of my business. So researching what else could I add to Una to have a name for my business? So Essuna was the result, and it's she is in Spanish, but also I love that.

[15:53] Sonya: Yeah.

[15:57] Lyndal: Doesn't it?

[15:57] Sonya: It does, because it's that ownership, isn't it? To me, it really does emote confidence and power, stepping into your power, you know? Oh, I love that. That's brilliant.

[16:13] Lyndal: Yeah. So that's where the name came from.

[16:17] Sonya: I love it so much. So where have you evolved to obviously, six years ago was when this idea I'm sure there was a period of all of your research and development and having to learn how to design and get things made, and I'm sure that there were testing and sampling and all of that sort of thing. Where are you at today?

[16:36] Lyndal: Yes.

[16:37] Sonya: Okay.

[16:38] Lyndal: So it took me two years to actually launch my own online website. So this summer, coming up now is my fifth summer season, if it ever becomes summer. Completely crazy. I keep on thinking sun must come.

[17:00] Sonya: Out tomorrow, but I know, yeah.

[17:04] Lyndal: Bet our bottom dollar that tomorrow there'll be sun.

[17:07] Sonya: Oh, there you go. Yeah, it will come. Yes, I know. Unfortunately, in Australia in particular, summer has eluded us for what feels like a good couple of years now.

[17:20] Lyndal: Yeah. So it's coming. So this year will be my fifth season, and at the end of last year, I decided that I really needed to step into as soon as my main business. So that's what I did last summer and it's really helped me to believe in the business more, because when it's a side gig, it's like, at the end of the day, you kind of fit in things to do, but when.

[17:45] Sonya: It'S your primary focus, isn't it?

[17:48] Lyndal: Yes, but when it's your primary focus, it's what you wake up in the morning to do each day. So that's been a huge learning experience for me in my personal development, regaining the passion of when I first launched it, to believe in myself, and the vision again today, which has been really good, but also a lot in the landscape. The retail landscape has changed a lot, especially this year during COVID it really was gangbusters. Everybody was buying online and it was a very exciting time. And because I'm Australian made, that was another thing in my favor. But since covered over the retail, the retail landscape is changing, shifting again. Yeah, it's really I think it's over.

[18:40] Sonya: You sell online, obviously. Do you wholesale into retail stores as well? Like, can women go into any stores to find your product, that sort of thing?

[18:50] Lyndal: Well, that's the big change. So I did a mail out in August, so I have been selling through some retailers, and in August I did a mail out to about 200 retailers. That all stock me. Some are prospects and some are sell my product, and about 30% were returned to Sender, which means the business is not there.

[19:12] Sonya: Any businesses have closed. OK. Yeah.

[19:16] Lyndal: So that's huge.

[19:18] Sonya: That is a big, huge chunk of.

[19:21] Lyndal: Your marketplaces that I use are changing the structure of the way they operate as well. It's an interesting time. So building direct business is my focus. Pretty well. Good.

[19:37] Sonya: Well, that's amazing. I'm so pleased to hear that. So, talk us through the products that you do have with the Asuna line.

[19:44] Lyndal: Yep. So they're all rashes, so they're tops bottoms and dresses that you wear over your bathers or shape wear, or whatever you want to wear underneath. Some women wear bras and nickels, other women wear their bathers. And I have to report that I now wear a bikini under mine, whereas I never thought I'd wear a bikini again.

[20:06] Sonya: Yeah, I was going to say, I'm assuming it's been a while since you wore a bikini. That's fantastic. So having that, the rashy, the outerwear, to kind of be able to COVID up with, I guess once you've made you comfortable enough to wear a bikini again on the beach, I think that's amazing.

[20:25] Lyndal: You can't see the bikini, but I've got one.

[20:27] Sonya: And I like that because you know that you're wearing your bikini, therefore you've taken on that energy and you're embodying the confidence that comes with that. And that within itself is powerful. Yes, that's good.

[20:43] Lyndal: For me, wearing a bikini means I can choose an underwire that supports me better, for example, rather easier to go.

[20:50] Sonya: To the bathroom and more practical.

[20:53] Lyndal: I'm an extremely practical person.

[20:56] Sonya: You are.

[20:59] Lyndal: So, yeah. So that's what I do every summer. So I like wearing a dress and I also like wearing the swim shorts because they've got a really lovely flat, wide waistband that I really like to flatten my stomach. So that's what I like wearing. But the designs are really based on highlighting or covering different areas of your body that you want to highlight or you don't want to highlight. So most of the range has shoulder protection because sun protection is a big deal. And in fact, since I've launched, what I was considering would be body confidence. I don't like the size that I am. It's actually ended up addressing so many body confidence issues that are a result of treatments. Like many women who have cancer treatment have to limit their UV exposure.

[21:50] Sonya: That's right, yeah.

[21:52] Lyndal: And it's really, really rewarding when I get feedback from a customer who bought one of my rashes. So a lady in Queensland called me. She said, Linda, I just had to call you. I look after my grandchildren every holidays and Grandpa takes them down the beach and I stay at home because of the UV radiation, she can't go in the sun for very long. And she said, I can now take my grandchildren to the beach every day.

[22:17] Sonya: Wow. That's life changing.

[22:19] Lyndal: It's really life changing. And that doesn't it?

[22:27] Sonya: It does. And feedback like that really solidifies for you, why you're doing what you're doing and running a business is not easy. And what you have done when you've stepped into an industry where you haven't had no experience. So it's hard at times, but it's the feedback like that that makes it all worthwhile.

[22:51] Lyndal: Absolutely. Another lady had Lymphedema when you have swollen.

[22:56] Sonya: Yeah.

[22:57] Lyndal: So she had one arm that was bigger than the other with Lymphedema. So she felt really self conscious going to the beach because she liked the way people could see that she had one arm bigger than the other. So now she wears one of my long sleeve dresses and nobody can tell. So I think that's really wonderful and that's what I want to grow my business, because I want to help more women.

[23:25] Sonya: Love that. I think that what you're doing is incredible and still Australian made. So making locally.

[23:36] Lyndal: Yes, I've been made in Adelaide for, I think, three years and the first year I made out of Melbourne. But another consequence of COVID is my manufacturer just closed down two weeks ago.

[23:48] Sonya: OK.

[23:50] Lyndal: Fortunately another business has bought them so I will be able to continue to make in Adelaide next season.

[23:57] Sonya: Okay, great.

[23:58] Lyndal: That's just an example of the turbulence.

[24:01] Sonya: No, but the turmoil. Yeah.

[24:04] Lyndal: You just have to be ready to be proactive and change the way you operate.

[24:08] Sonya: Yeah, it's that flexibility, isn't it? That you have to have as a business owner and being able to pivot really quickly when something does present itself where you go oh, okay, I wasn't expecting that. And troubleshooting and moving if that means moving in a direction that's different to what you thought you'd be doing, being able to go with that.

[24:26] Lyndal: Yeah, absolutely. The other thing that's really important is the sun protective element of Estonia and I did a promotion the other week with Adelaide Fashion Week and I partnered up with Skin Check Champions who are they are promoting for National Campaign for Melanoma Awareness and they do like popup check stations around a lot of regions in Australia actually. But what I was I had a stall in the mall.

[24:56] Sonya: A stall in the mall? Yeah.

[24:58] Lyndal: And I was promoting getting a skin check along with my son's safe stuff. And I had two women come up to me and one of them said that's so important. Skin checks are important. I had melanoma, what a great idea this is, blah blah, blah. And I said to her girlfriend here, would you like to take a card because it had this QR code to book your skin check appointment in? And she said no, no, I haven't had my skin checked. And I said Ever? And she said no. And I said Your friend has had melanoma. Has that not spurred you on to take some sort of risk strategy? And she said I can't bear the thought of it because I don't want somebody to be looking at my body.

[25:52] Sonya: Oh wow.

[25:54] Lyndal: I know. And she was a very slim lady. But my body confidence journey with as soon as it's not just swimwear, women all over have body confidence issues that stop them enjoying life or thinking of.

[26:11] Sonya: The behaviors and seeing a specialist to just have a check that could literally save your life.

[26:18] Lyndal: Yeah, it's interesting.

[26:20] Sonya: That's not where I thought you were going to go with that story. I thought it was going to be around the fear of actually finding that she had a diagnosis and she needed to then deal with it. Yeah, I didn't expect that. That's really sad.

[26:32] Lyndal: No, but I learned things like that every day and that's the other interesting thing about running a business with you know, that helps in this unprotectation is you do learn a lot about people's journeys and super interesting.

[26:52] Sonya: Yeah, I'm sure it has. I love so much about your story. There is the body image part of everything that's built into it. I'm a huge advocate for women stepping into their power and chasing a dream and a goal and putting themselves out there to do that, and you have absolutely done that. And the life saving side of the sun protection and the championing melanoma awareness and all of that sort of thing, I think is also incredibly important. I think, Linda, you're doing an amazing, amazing job and you should be very proud of what you've created and the difference that you're making in the lives of so many.

[27:39] Lyndal: I think it's rewarding, hearing about the difference, that's the most rewarding part. And I'm sure that's the same with you and your business and having this podcast and training people. It's seeing others thrive.

[27:51] Sonya: That's right, because we take our own knowledge for granted often, and it's passing that on to others that can make such a difference for some people, particularly somewhere.

[28:05] Lyndal: Absolutely.

[28:06] Sonya: So I have two questions for you related to your business. The first one is, what advice would you have for a woman who is perhaps really struggling with her self confidence as a result of having some spotty image issues? From the conversations you've had, from your own experience, what is your one big piece of advice that you would pass on?

[28:35] Lyndal: The joy of getting involved in something again is reward for trying to overcome your insecurities. And many so women, when they come and see my range, oh, I don't go to the beach anymore. Why don't you? Did you used to like going to the beach? Oh, absolutely. Loved it when I was a kid. Yeah. And enabling people to get back to the beach is like it's a thrill. I had one lady had an overgrowth of hair body, but she didn't go to the beach because wearing gorgeous is too revealing for her. And she wrote to me and said, linda, I went to the beach with my kids the other day and she said, I'm going to do that all the time. And it's brave taking those steps.

[29:25] Sonya: It is. It's very brave, really brave.

[29:28] Lyndal: But taking overcoming those challenges and really being courageous, the reward of the new experiences that you can have as a result is a great reward.

[29:41] Sonya: It is, isn't it? And it was interesting while we were just talking then I was thinking that we should also maybe talk about the fact that it's maybe not even just the beach that some people are being prohibited from doing. It might be going to their local pool and swimming laps that maybe they used to enjoy when they were younger and now don't. Maybe that could also be something that they're missing out on now. There are so many reasons that we hide our bodies away that could be overcome by having something as simple as the product that you've created while you're doing it. Exactly. And my next question is what advice do you have for a woman who is perhaps listening to this that's had an idea, a spark of an idea in a head from a business perspective, but not really ever either had the courage or the knowledge to actually go out and execute it? What advice do you have for her?

[30:39] Lyndal: My advice is listen to podcasts that are about whatever the topic is you're interested in. Okay. Because I think getting an education is the biggest liberator of all. So whatever you're interested in getting education podcasts are super easy because you can walk the dog and listen to a podcast so accessible. Yeah. And then if you something sparks your interest, you can go home and research it online. The other thing I would recommend is joining a community where you can talk about whatever your idea is and I would not be afraid about your idea being stolen. I think that's such a strange thing because an idea has no value until it's implemented. Yeah, that's right. And your passion is what drives and implements and derives the value from an idea. So workshoping ideas with friends or joining some sort of community, whether it's a Facebook group or like a short course where other people are trying to learn similar things to you, that is really, really valuable.

[31:46] Sonya: Yes. Instead of holding it in and feeling like you need to protect it and not talk about it because somebody might run off with it and make it their idea. Yeah. I think that's really valuable advice. Yeah. I think we've probably all experienced that at some point where there's been something that we've just wanted to hold in close and guard and yes, it's getting it out there and having the conversations that can actually change be the difference between whether you do something or whether you don't.

[32:13] Lyndal: Yes. I went to a trade show in Melbourne in August and the lady in the stall next to me happened to be an Adelaide fashion designer as well. And we've been meeting every week since then. And my business growth since meeting her just because she's so motivating and having someone who's got the same challenges you and really a day that looks just like mine is really I find it's a kinship inspired.

[32:40] Sonya: It also reminds me that is one of the beauties of working or partnering with other women is women don't always have that tendency to be competitive about working. Like, I'm doing the same thing as you, so therefore I'm not going to share my ideas with you and I'm not going to talk to you because you might, like you said earlier, run off with my idea. I think women are so much more supportive of each other that competitive doesn't actually really become a thing.

[33:11] Lyndal: No. Collaborating is what helps you grow.

[33:14] Sonya: Yeah.

[33:16] Lyndal: That's something that I really believe in.

[33:18] Sonya: Yeah. Awesome. I love that. All right, we're going to wrap our wonderful conversation up and. I'm going to ask you the same question I asked many of my guests, and that is what are you reading, watching, or listening to right now that is bringing you joy?

[33:33] Lyndal: Okay. I should pick a podcast as I've just spoke to the benefits of them. I'm not going to pick a TV series called The Empress about Queen Elizabeth of Austria, and it has the most beautiful costumes that I've ever seen in my life on that series. Of course, I binge watched it over two nights.

[34:00] Sonya: And what platform is this on? What platform are you binging?

[34:04] Lyndal: I think it's Netflix, actually.

[34:07] Sonya: I'll find it and I'll link it in the Show notes for anyone that's listening and interested.

[34:11] Lyndal: Well, just overwhelmed by how beautiful the costumes are.

[34:16] Sonya: Oh, wow.

[34:18] Lyndal: Filmed in Austria and it's just magnificent to watch. Brilliant.

[34:23] Sonya: The Empress.

[34:25] Lyndal: The Empress.

[34:26] Sonya: Excellent. Linda, thank you so much for sharing that with us. But also, thank you so much for sharing your story, your amazing swimwear brand or your rashy brand. And I'm going to make sure everything is linked through to in the show notes so that if any women are interested in finding your products, and I highly recommend that they do, it's the start of summer here. We are going to have summer. I'm being positive.

[34:51] Lyndal: We are.

[34:53] Sonya: It's time to find yourself a nice piece of arashi or a dress or something that you can get out. Get out. Enjoy the pool, the beach, or wherever it is that you hang and make the most of your summer.

[35:07] Lyndal: Absolutely. Thank you very much. Sonia.

[35:14] Sonya: Thank you for listening today. I am so grateful to have these conversations with incredible women and experts, and I'm grateful that you chose to hit play on this episode of Dear Menopause. If you have a minute of time today, please leave a rating or a review. I would love to hear from you because you are my biggest driver for doing this work. If this chat went way too fast for you and you want more, head over to Stellarwomen.com Au podcast for the Show Notes. And while you're there, take my Midlife quiz to see why it feels like Midlife is messing with your head.